2023-10-24 08:52:01
The businessman (for 25 years president of Carulla) Samuel Azout, of Jewish business birth from Barranquilla and today a social development philanthropist, with important foundations for children, ended up having his X account suspended for alleged disrespect towards President Petro. But he does not rectify his opinions regarding the president’s mistaken tweets regarding the Israel-Palestine war.
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The last time I saw you, Sammy, you were president of Carulla (for 25 years) and then as a senior official for social development in the Santos government. What does he do today?
I am currently founder and president of Fútbol con Corazón, a non-profit social company dedicated to the socio-emotional development of boys and girls, born in Colombia but already present in five countries. I also founded and chair the aeioTU project, on early childhood, which is part of the Carulla Foundation.
Samuel Azout sharing with several children.
Then, he left business behind to dedicate himself to social development…
My career is simple: 25 years in private business, then a student, then three in government and the rest in the social sector.
(Read also: Samuel Azout, from businessman to philanthropist)
He was very curious that what is now called X (formerly Twitter) canceled his account for some messages considered very aggressive once morest President Petro. Would you say it was justified?
Compared to what I hear and read on social media, the words I used did not merit suspension. However, I recognize that, in some way, I did not use the most appropriate words to refer to Mr. President, but I stand by the substance of my statements.
Yes, well, it is one thing to accuse him of addictions, and another to express, as is your right, what you, as a person of Jewish origin, are feeling regarding what is happening between Israel and Gaza. What do you fundamentally demand from President Gustavo Petro?
He was very wrong regarding three things. He did not condemn the atrocity and horror of Hamas, but justified it, even though he left thousands of Israelis dead and wounded, as well as several hostages. Secondly, the President equated Israel with the Nazis, who condemned 6,000,000 innocent Jews to systematic death in concentration camps and gas chambers; but Israel is not fighting innocent people, it is facing a regime of terror, so the comparison is offensive and vile.
The Barranquilla businessman Samuel Azout
(Also read: Samuel Azout, the philanthropist of Santos)
The third mistake was the threat of breaking relations with Israel, a great ally of Colombia, and a country with which it has a positive trade balance relationship of more than 900 million dollars. With the potential to acquire many more products from Colombia and transfer technology in many fields. Their trills, repeated and dangerous, can ruin this relationship.
There must be a lot of tension from the Israeli community in Colombia…
A lot, because she doesn’t feel safe (including my own relatives). Some have even left the country. Many are thinking regarding disinvesting in Colombia. It is not convenient to bring these conflicts to Colombia, because what is happening in Gaza is truly a horror and a humanitarian catastrophe.
Colombia has had the best relations with the Palestinians, especially the Christian Palestinians, who have been friends, partners, people we love, close, endearing people; and there has been a lot of cordiality between the Palestinian community, also the Lebanese, with the Jewish community and we do not want these relations to be affected at all. We can differ respectfully, without going to unnecessary extremes.
Samuel Azout was born into a Jewish family from Barranquilla dedicated to commerce.
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What might have led, pushed Hamas, which is categorically a terrorist group, to commit this attack planned for months? Some blame Prime Minister Netanyahu’s extremism, which broke their cup. Do you agree?
I believe that the Palestinians are a dignified and long-suffering people and, like many other peoples in the world, they have been victims of displacement and many injustices. But we cannot forget that Hamas is part of the extremist Islamic fundamentalist current of Iran, which together with Hezbollah, with Al Qaeda, with Isis, with the ayatollahs, they support jihad, whose objective is the complete destruction of Israel and the annihilation of the Jews of the planet, from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea.
“I believe that the Palestinians are a dignified and long-suffering people and, like many other peoples in the world, they have been victims of displacement and many injustices.”
We make them uncomfortable because we are a country where there are sexual and ideological freedoms, where there are civil liberties, where there is open and dynamic democracy… Freedom for women, for gay or transsexual people, for everyone. This type of life, that of the West, is not acceptable to Hamas. Believe me, following the Jews, they will go following the Christians.
Do you believe that it is feasible that two independent states, Palestine and Israel, end up peacefully coexisting, without wars, without terrorist attacks, or is it a chimera?
If possible. And I have the great hope that it will happen. Obviously in Judaism there are different opinions, but I believe in two countries living in peace, one next to the other, with both capital in Jerusalem. Can you imagine what the Middle East would be like? Go sightseeing, go through Jerusalem, through Bethlehem, go through all the historical areas in peace, tasting the delicious food of Palestine, with its friendly people, of which there are many… What can be created as a development center, if it arrives Peace to the Middle East would be like the new Europe. But that cannot be achieved without first destroying the military and political apparatus of Hamas, which is financed by Iran. They are the spoke in the wheel and those who do not allow us to reach definitive peace in the Middle East.
(Also read: ‘A break along the way is always beneficial’: Samuel Azout)
President Biden’s visit was intended, in addition to expressing his absolute solidarity with Israel, to ask Prime Minister Netanyahu uncomfortable questions regarding his military plans once morest Gaza. Annihilate the terrorist groups, yes, but take care to avoid engaging in violence once morest the civilian population, which is left vulnerable in that war. To what extent is it legitimate for Israel to advance its military plans, bypassing the civilian population?
Well, the question is pertinent, but let me tell you. This attack, in which all kinds of atrocities and barbarities were committed, was not simply an act; It is the manifestation of a murderous conviction backed by a military apparatus. Gaza is full of tunnels, weapons, and missiles, all the result of the training that these terrorists have received from Iran.
“If peace came to the Middle East, it would be like the new Europe.”
So I return the question: What would be the reasonable reaction to this attack by a neighbor who wants its total destruction, who is armed to the teeth, who is getting stronger every day to make a final attack and eliminate it completely? They demonstrated all the cruelty of which they are capable… I return the question to the people who say that Israel should not bomb because there are civilians at risk… What would be a reasonable response, in the face of a neighbor that is preparing for its total destruction? I recognize that the answer poses a moral dilemma, but Israelis are tired of going to shelters, seeing that every day they kill one or kill thousands.
Israelis at Kibbutz Beeri, near the border with the Gaza Strip.
Photo:
If we do not fight them now, the lives of 10,000,000 citizens in Israel are at risk. We are begging Hamas to use measures to protect its civilians, not place them as human shields. Of this entire war, the worst event has been the death of more than 500 people in a hospital, which was self-inflicted…
That’s what the US confirms…
The thing is that the Israelis do not direct their missiles at schools and colleges, nor at mosques. Believe me, it hurts us Jews more than anyone else, because if anyone has suffered displacements, atrocious crimes, it has been the Jews throughout their history. And this town has memory, which awakens a great defensive instinct. We are not colonialists, we are nationalists, we defend the liberation of the Jewish nation. Israel has not taken anyone’s land. What did happen is that in the year 48, when the United Nations had just been founded, the territory was partitioned between an Arab State and a Jewish State.
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But neither party was satisfied…
And the Palestinians were given the best part, because they gave us the desert, the arid land, and they gave them the hills of Judea, which is called Judea because that’s where the Jews come from. And do you know what they did? They attacked with the argument that Israel has no right to exist… How do they not have the right to exist? Yes there, in the Torah, which is the Jewish Bible, Jerusalem is mentioned 700 times. We pray towards Jerusalem, all the synagogues are oriented towards Jerusalem.
King David, 1,000 years before Christ, was the king of the Jews in Jerusalem, where we have the Jewish temples. So, here it is not correct to say that Israel is colonialist, nor that it took away anyone’s land. In the year 48, we must also recognize it to be objective, there were displaced Palestinians, as there are in all wars, as happens when there are attacks and there are counterattacks. So this dispute has many nuances. But the war that Israel is waging is not once morest Palestine or once morest Islam, but once morest fundamentalist Islam.
Finally, the visit of President Biden and his Secretary of State had the objective, among other things, of ensuring that a humanitarian passage is agreed upon, so that the people of Gaza can take refuge, be fed, and be treated in hospitals. It seems to me that diplomacy is going through a great test. It might be the only way to avoid another massacre, this time in Gaza, by arranging a humanitarian pause while firmer agreements are made…
I totally agree with doing strong humanitarian work, to avoid the loss of more civilian lives. Everything necessary must be done to protect that population and the diplomatic intervention of all countries. Via humanitarian corridors, via temporary camps, refugees in Egypt, or many other ways that might exist to avoid death, which is extremely painful. A single death of a child, whether Jewish or Palestinian, is something we cannot accept.
Human beings have to be able to resolve our differences in other ways, because humanity really disappoints. And believe me, Israel, in the midst of all this dilemma, does a lot to prevent these deaths. It is the only army in the world that warns before bombing, that sends text messages to all the inhabitants, with enough time for them to evacuate. But if we want peace in the Middle East and in the world, we have to stop terror and stopping it is often costly, unfortunately in human lives. But everything must be done to minimize the loss of civilian life.
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In your suspended trills for X, you challenge President Petro to dare to cut relations with Israel. Do you think that the danger is already averted following he met with the Israeli ambassador very smiling, or does that possibility still exist? Or is he threatening but not capable?
He has neither the political capital, nor the moral strength, nor the intellectual reason for that. If he did so, it would be like political suicide for him because he would put the best interests of Colombians first. Therefore, it bothers him very much that he makes threats that he himself knows he cannot carry out. He seems quite irresponsible and too challenging to me. Notice that both he and the Foreign Ministry have stopped speaking in those terms.
Well, I hope they return your account
Thank you so much. Let us pray for peace in Israel, for peace in the Middle East and for the entire world.
MARÍA ISABEL RUEDA – FOR TIME
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