At the age of 50, producer and DJ Carl Craig, pioneer of Detroit techno and boss of his own Planet E label since 1996, continues to string together sets, performing up to 180 times a year. Number met him on one of his dates, in Turin, where he is the headliner of the electronic music festival KappaFutur Festival 2022.
Carl Craig au Royal Albert Hall en 2019 à Londres. (Photo by Christie Goodwin/Redferns via Getty Images)
Number: What songs did you play first and last during your set?
Carl Craig : The first was my title Party. It’s part of my project Party/Afterpartyan installation I made in New York in 2020. The last one was Knights of the Jaguar, by DJ Rolando, a Detroit classic released in 1999 on the Underground Resistance label.
Do you always have the habit of playing at least one of your titles at the opening and closing of the set?
When I play in my own party yes! [Rires]
Do you still live in Detroit? Where should you go, there, if you are a music lover?
I still live there, yes. There are new clubs that have opened, the Spotlight and the Marble Bar. But there’ll never be a place like the Music Institute [boîte de nuit fermée en 1989]which was our version of the Paradise Garage [club mythique new-yorkais, ouvert en 1978 et fermé en 1987, où est né la musique garage]. They played wonderful music that healed the body and the soul.
In 1997 you released the legendary album More Songs About Food and Revolutionary Art. What did you mean with this title?
In the late 1970s and early 1980s, the television show Saturday Night Live featured some very high-profile artists, like the B-52’s and the Talking Heads. That’s when I heard their title For Artists Only, sorti on the album More Songs About Buildings and Food [1978]. This struck me. I was also inspired a lot by the album 20 Jazz Funk Greats, of the band Throbbing Gristle [1979]. In short, music from my childhood.
Why is music a revolutionary art in your opinion?
Because too many people try to standardize it like it’s wallpaper. A lot of people who were in the crowd tonight may appreciate a bassline but they won’t connect with the texture of the music itself. In Detroit, people think that if you don’t sell a million records, your music isn’t good. It’s a very American concept. And I think the music should be true, stay underground and it should have meaning, values and textures… And shouldn’t just repeat the same things to the masses to get their attention.
Do you think artists should have a political opinion and defend it to their fans? If yes, how ?
In the United States, there is an expression called “Shut up and dribble”. A TV presenter directed her to LeBron James saying, “Stop talking politics and go play some basketball.” But politics is a major theme in music. Bob Dylan, Nina Simone, Marvin Gaye and the Temptations talked regarding war and social issues. Now we tell musicians, ‘Shut up and dribble’. We don’t want to know their political opinion. A lot of musicians produce just to do DJ sets and not to tell a story. With social networks and the woke culture, we have come to a time where people spend their time criticizing artists. And if you defend yourself, they say you’re the asshole! So you have to go back to politics but not do it to be trendy…
What do you mean by that ?
In the 90s, people liked Public Enemy and Underground Resistance because they brought a political dimension to their art. But when they really started talking regarding politics, no one wanted to listen to them!
What is your definition of influence?
This is one of the most important things. But it can be positive and negative and that’s life. The influence of a Christian will always be criticized by others for not believing in God. I honor the influence and Miles Davies. He had dark times in the 70s where he took coke all the time… He was seen as an odious character but whatever! Now people think it’s okay to take coke.
So you think we should separate the man from the artist?
Absolutely. Monsters produce music and make awesome movies. You can throw Harvey Weinstein in jail but without him, Pulp Fiction would never have seen the light of day! Today, everyone loves Snoop Dogg but he still killed someone! And do lots of other things. People like gangsters because they think they’re actors. Snoop Dogg probably wouldn’t do that once more today but he still shot and killed someone in a grocery store… It’s a huge part of music history: gangsters have ruled the industry forever. Even Suge Knight [co-fondateur, avec Dr. Dre, du label Death Row Records plusieurs fois accusé de meurtre et soupçonné, par certains, d’avoir commandité l’assassinat de Tupac] is a product of a system that has been around for much longer.
Do you remember when you became a legend to others?
As soon as I came out of my mother’s womb. [Rires]
What do you think regarding superstars like Drake and Beyonce increasingly using house productions in their music?
I have no problem with that. Beyonce just retired Robin S! Drake has worked a lot with Black Coffee before, he’s a house producer! It’s pretty awesome for the genre that all of this is happening! And pop has always touched on house: Pet Shop Boys did it by working with The Sterling Void. Truth be told, I’m surprised Beyonce hasn’t done it before.
Are you sometimes afraid of losing inspiration?
I’ve been making music for 30 years and I’m only afraid of losing my hearing. I will never produce a super mainstream album or Beyonce’s next one…
Would you say no?
It’s interesting financially… Look what happened with the series Inner City by Kevin Saunderson, he still earns a lot of money for titles he produced thirty years ago!
Are you making enough money?
You can never earn enough! You may think you are comfortable but the whole system can suddenly collapse: going from a million to a dollar in your account. There are so many people who lose money following investing in cryptocurrencies…
Are you interested in NFTs?
Most NFTs released to market will never reach the value of the first ones when it exploded. People spent money stupidly on this… The creative aspect interests me more than the financial aspect.
How stimulating can this be from a creative point of view?
The possibilities generated by technology are insane. You can listen to an album in a lot of different ways and I like the fact that it’s not mass-reproduced. Like my setup Party/Afterparty, you have to go there and see me play to listen to the music. What the Wu-Tang Clan did by producing a single copy album [Once Upon a Time in Shaolin, vendu en 2015 à Martin Shkreli, l’homme le plus détesté au monde] was something I had in mind for a long time… Besides, it’s a shame they didn’t sell it more! I don’t even know if we’ll ever be able to listen to it: even if they got the rights, Ghostface Killah hates the album, so it will probably never be released. I love the idea that to be able to listen to an album, you have to go to the person who owns it, ask them to do it and wait for them to say yes or no.
So you are once morest easy access to music for everyone?
Listening to music online is like stopping in the street in front of a guy singing and dancing for parts. You can sit there for hours wondering if you’ll end up giving him a dollar. That’s what streaming platforms are: people want to listen to music for free. Some get by producing for commercials and cinema but when it’s underground it’s drowned in the flow and people forget. So I prefer people to be like, ‘Okay, I’m coming to see Carl Craig play something that I’ll never be able to hear once more’. And that’s what DJs did in the early days of techno: they crossed out names on records so people wouldn’t find them. There were titles only played by Franckie Knuckles, others by Derrick May, Jeff Mills… We went there because we knew that the DJ was going to replay this title that we only hear during his sets.
Do you prefer clubs that don’t allow taking photos?
I like the idea that a bad memory just stays in your head. My father went to Birdland [club de jazz emblématique de Manhattan nommé ainsi en l’honneur de Charlie Parker] in the 50s and he thought it was terrible because everyone thought it was great! I loved. When I do a bad set, if it’s on people’s minds, it’s ok, but on the Internet, people won’t miss me… However, I do 180 concerts a year!
How have platforms transformed the music industry?
Artists have been significantly impoverished. Before, if you had your own label, you might make a lot of money selling physical copies. At one time, Kevin Saunderson loaded his truck with tens of thousands of records and drove around Chicago every weekend. He sold everything in cash to bankers, post office workers or the guy at the gas station…
